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Author Topic: 3% origination fee  (Read 22717 times)

noworries

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2009, 08:22:22 am »

I just noticed that closing fee had changed to 0.5% for AA borrowers with no minimum fee. It's still 3% with $50 minimum for A-HR scores.

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mothandrust

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2009, 11:37:22 am »

I posted here about how DiscoverPersonalLoans was offering 8.99% on unsecured 3-year loans up to 15K...

http://www.prospers.org/forum/discoverpersonalloanscom_3_year_terms_at_899_apr_for_5k15k-t16687.0.html

Looking a list of AA's borrowing $10K+, some are getting Prosper loans at 23% and out of about 50 there are 4 that are getting a rate under 10%.

This AA on 10/19 was the more recent:

http://www.prosper.com/invest/listing.aspx?listingID=425284

Lenders get an 8.94% APR and the borrower is paying a 10.29% APR.

So since the Discover product has come out, AA borrowers who want to borrow 10K+ will get a better (8.99%) rate there than what Prosper is offering.
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noworries

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2009, 12:36:24 pm »

I posted here about how DiscoverPersonalLoans was offering 8.99% on unsecured 3-year loans up to 15K...

http://www.prospers.org/forum/discoverpersonalloanscom_3_year_terms_at_899_apr_for_5k15k-t16687.0.html

Looking a list of AA's borrowing $10K+, some are getting Prosper loans at 23% and out of about 50 there are 4 that are getting a rate under 10%.

This AA on 10/19 was the more recent:

http://www.prosper.com/invest/listing.aspx?listingID=425284

Lenders get an 8.94% APR and the borrower is paying a 10.29% APR.

So since the Discover product has come out, AA borrowers who want to borrow 10K+ will get a better (8.99%) rate there than what Prosper is offering.

Interesting, I tried creating a simple listing to see my "credit grade" and was allowed to set starting APIR  as low as 4.29%.  I also noticed that closing fee was only 0.5% I remember last time I did a "credit grade pull" - created a new listing - origination fee was 3.0 accross the board.

I don't know if there are chances of funding at 4.29APR (lenders get only 3.29APR as 1% is a service fee).
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mothandrust

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2009, 12:54:10 pm »

If you're looking to borrow less than 5K, there are listings that are funding at 7% or lower.



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havastat

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #34 on: November 08, 2009, 11:57:52 am »

I think overall it's reasonable for Prosper (and Lending Club, which is doing something similar) to charge much higher fees than originally expected. It's become clear they have to do a lot more work than we and they had thought to have a viable business. Because of the potential for fraud, each borrower has to be individually screened and have information verified at the front end, lenders need a lot more guidance and hand-holding about the appropriate price to pay, and collection expenses are much more than previously thought. All this costs and has to be paid for somehow.

It would better align with lenders' real interests if the interest spread were raised so that Prosper and Lending club collect only if the borrower pays. Collecting fees up front increases the temptation to allow junk through. It also reduces borrower demand. But increasing the fees borrowers pay makes it appear to lenders that prices are being held constant and hence avoids reducing lender demand -- at least lenders who haven't actually thought the implications of the fee-shifting through. It's something of a paradox that increasing lender fees rather than borrower fees would be better for lenders in the long run, and most lenders wouldn't get this.

Of course there's never been a problem with borrower demand -- just demand by the sort of borrower who's actually willing and able to repay.
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Investar

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #35 on: November 08, 2009, 12:51:08 pm »


I think overall it's reasonable for Prosper (and Lending Club, which is doing something similar) to charge much higher fees than originally expected... Of course there's never been a problem with borrower demand -- just demand by the sort of borrower who's actually willing and able to repay.

As long as these fees stay in line with "cash transfer fees" charged by the industry they should not be a hinderance. A quarter or half-point under the card companies could be a 'carrot'. Seems to me the general borrower population should begin to mature (assimilate the group major agencies enjoy) once P2P breaks out of it's niche and becomes more widely known and accepted.
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no-whammies

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #36 on: November 08, 2009, 12:53:34 pm »

I think overall it's reasonable for Prosper (and Lending Club, which is doing something similar) to charge much higher fees than originally expected. It's become clear they have to do a lot more work than we and they had thought to have a viable business. Because of the potential for fraud, each borrower has to be individually screened and have information verified at the front end, lenders need a lot more guidance and hand-holding about the appropriate price to pay, and collection expenses are much more than previously thought. All this costs and has to be paid for somehow.

I can state from personal experience, Prosper 3.0 is still not doing due diligence in this area.  And my experience with Prosper's verification (borrower side) process was only two weeks ago.  I refused to fund the loan for other reasons.
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bamalucky

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #37 on: November 08, 2009, 12:58:42 pm »

Quote
each borrower has to be individually screened and have information verified at the front end,

do you have any evidence that Prosper is doing that?

I have evidence that shows they do it in about 20% of loans from their own mouth. Read the SEC filings
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havastat

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Re: 3% origination fee
« Reply #38 on: November 08, 2009, 04:07:31 pm »

Quote
As long as these fees stay in line with "cash transfer fees" charged by the industry they should not be a hinderance. A quarter or half-point under the card companies could be a 'carrot'. Seems to me the general borrower population should begin to mature (assimilate the group major agencies enjoy) once P2P breaks out of it's niche and becomes more widely known and accepted. 

 
The comparator isn't "cash transfer fees". The comparator is the spread between what banks pay depositors and what they charge lenders. That spread pays for services that Prosper and its lenders thought were unnecessary when Prosper first started. Prosper's 1.0 loan outcomes make clear that true automated p2p doesn't work: acquiring information about borrowers and assessing risk at the front end and handling collections at the back end all require work on each individual loan that can't be completely automated, and a back office and staff to do the work. Those services have to be provided and paid for. To pay for them, Prosper and Lending Club have to take more of the spread than they did when the idea was to completely automate the process and not have a back office that did much other than marketing and promotion.

Whether Prosper will be able to run a back office successfully, or is even spending money on what needs to to run a successful back office, remains to be seen.

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