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Author Topic: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia  (Read 27965 times)

traveler505

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Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« on: December 25, 2007, 04:53:00 pm »

[A longer version of this post appeared on the Verified Lenders forum on November 8, 2007.  Since Prosper.com has promised that a debt sale will be finalized by the end of this month, this seemed like an appropriate time to make it available to a larger audience.  For those of you who are wondering, I have received no reply to or acknowledgment of my offer.]

MNH Report #4

Over the past year or so, various lenders have expressed an interest in buying defaulted Prosper loans, but various Prosper employees (most recently Doug Fuller, as channelled through Shira) have said that Prosper would not sell defaulted loans to Prosper lenders. 

However, to the best of my knowledge, all of these conversations have occurred at a theoretical level, and both the lenders who wanted to buy the defaulted loans and the Prosper employees who said they wouldn't sell might have just been blowing smoke.  There has, again to the best of my knowledge, never been a formal, legally-binding, offer from a Prosper lender to purchase a defaulted loan, so Prosper management has never had to confront this issue directly.

Until now.

Yesterday, I mailed the following letter to Doug Fuller, with a copy to Ed Giedgowd, both by certified mail, return receipt requested:

Quote
November 7, 2007

Doug Fuller
Vice President of Operations
Prosper Marketplace Inc.
111 Sutter St, 22nd floor
San Francisco CA 94104

CERTIFIED MAIL – RETURN RECEIPT REQUESTED

Dear Dr. Fuller:

It has come to my attention that Loan No. **** (Borrower: ****) is more than 120 days past due, and is therefore eligible for sale to a debt buyer, as provided in Section 6.f. of the Lender Registration Agreement.

Accordingly, I hereby offer to purchase all Notes associated with Loan No. **** (Borrower: ****), together with the associated Servicing Rights (as that term is defined in the Lender Registration Agreement) and all causes of action against the borrower arising from this loan (including, but not limited to, claims based on contract and fraud theories), for the amount of **** percent (****%) of the outstanding principal amount due at the time of purchase. 

As servicing agent for the lenders on this loan, Prosper Marketplace, Inc., (PMI) has a fiduciary duty to maximize recovery of the lenders’ investment through the loan sale process.  After reviewing the results of past sales of comparable loans, I expect that this offer will be significantly more advantageous for lenders than the offers which PMI will receive from other debt buyers.  If so, it would be a violation of PMI’s fiduciary duty to the lenders to reject this offer.

The borrower on Loan No. **** is located in ****, and I reside in ****.  Based on my review of the relevant state statutes pertaining to collection of debts, it appears that no license is required to collect debts which have been purchased by the collector.  (In addition, debt collectors who are attempting to collect fewer than two debts on behalf of another person are specifically exempted from licensing requirements.)  Accordingly, I believe that I am fully qualified to purchase this debt under the terms of the Lender Registration Agreement.

As part of the purchase agreement, I will guarantee that all collection activity will be conducted in compliance with federal and state law, including the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act and the Fair Credit Reporting Act. 

I further certify that this is a bona fide offer to purchase a delinquent debt for the purpose of collecting that debt, to the extent permitted by law, and that I have had no prior communications whatsoever with the borrower, or any representative of the borrower, with respect to the purchase of this debt.

As you know, delinquent debts are a rapidly depreciating asset, and unreasonable delay on the part of PMI in acceptance of this offer may reduce the value of the Notes, Servicing Rights, and causes of action.  Accordingly, if this offer is not accepted by December 31, 2007, I reserve the right to withdraw or modify it with 30 days notice to PMI.  Because a withdrawal or modification would almost certainly reduce the amount recovered on behalf of the lenders, unreasonable delay, like rejection of this offer in favor of an inferior one, may constitute a breach of PMI’s fiduciary duty to the lenders.

Please feel free to contact me if you need any additional information, or to make arrangements for payment and assignment of the Notes, Servicing Rights, and causes of action.

Sincerely,
****  ****

cc:  Ed Giedgowd


I have been unable to identify any legal or regulatory issue which would prevent Prosper from selling defaulted loans to Prosper lenders (though it is possible that there may be some state-by-state licensing or regulatory issues based on the residence of the borrower, lender, or both).  And while I have my own theories as to why Prosper would prefer not to sell defaulted loans to Prosper lenders, I don't believe their preferences can be allowed to outweigh their fiduciary duty to obtain the highest possible sale price.

My offer was roughly 4 to 5 times what I expect the lenders would get in a bulk debt sale.  I wanted the difference to be dramatic enough to get Prosper's attention.   Obviously, each offer to purchase a defaulted loan raises the stakes for Prosper if it chooses to violate its fiduciary duty by rejecting the offers without legal justification, and increases the likelihood that lenders will be allowed to participate as debt buyers.



[The prior discussion thread -- accessible only to lenders with $500 or more in loans -- can be found at:

http://www.prospers.org/forum/travs_doityourself_secondary_market_panaderia-t3811.0.html

Previous MNH Reports, along with links to the corresponding Prospers.org threads, can be found on my blog:  http://blog.traveler505.com.]
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xraider

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2007, 05:02:31 pm »

Have you received any response?
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2007, 05:04:08 pm »

As of today, I have not received any reply or acknowledgment.
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ira01

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2007, 01:15:19 am »

As of today, I have not received any reply or acknowledgment.

I think that Prosper is really playing with fire here.  If, as we all expect, the loan is sold in the debt sale for considerably less than what you offered, it would be pretty hard for Prosper to justify its decision to completely blow you off. 

I think it would be perfectly appropriate for a lender on that loan to sue Prosper in small claims court for their share of the difference between your offer and the JDB price.  If the lender lived around San Francisco, it would be extremely easy and convenient to do so, and could really open the floodgates. 
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bamalucky

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2007, 09:06:13 am »

This 1 will go nowhere..Prosper is gonna claim they can't cut out individual loans because of time consumption & the ability to bundle them as a package.

IE: selling 1 socket for $5 out of a 24 piece set that retails for $19.95
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ducks

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2007, 09:37:51 am »

I agree. The cost of selling each loan individually would be too high. You might get somewhere by offering to buy that loan and all similar eligible loans. For example, by offering to buy all eligible loans in the same credit grade as that loan.
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #6 on: December 26, 2007, 10:47:15 am »

This 1 will go nowhere..Prosper is gonna claim they can't cut out individual loans because of time consumption & the ability to bundle them as a package.

IE: selling 1 socket for $5 out of a 24 piece set that retails for $19.95

But loans are not sold as a set, and reducing the quantity by one doesn't impair the value of the remaining loans.  Prosper almost certainly reserves the right to remove any individual loan from the sale if, for instance, the borrower brings it current. 
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nonattender

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #7 on: December 26, 2007, 10:50:45 am »

But loans are not sold as a set, and reducing the quantity by one doesn't impair the value of the remaining loans.  Prosper almost certainly reserves the right to remove any individual loan from the sale if, for instance, the borrower brings it current. 

Almost certainly = should = maybe so, maybe not.

-t
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2007, 10:54:55 am »

I agree. The cost of selling each loan individually would be too high. You might get somewhere by offering to buy that loan and all similar eligible loans. For example, by offering to buy all eligible loans in the same credit grade as that loan.

On one of the Doug Fuller Q&As, he noted the existence of a website where Prosper could offer debts for purchase, one-by-one.  I didn't suggest that Prosper create a whole marketing campaign around the sale of individual loans, only that they compare the benefits of my offer for lenders against the offers made by other debt buyers.  Aside from an extra phone call to negotiate final terms, and generation of a couple extra pieces of paper, I don't see any additional costs involved in accepting my offer.

And, if there were, Prosper is entitled to deduct the expenses of conducting the sale from the amount that it pays lenders.  My offer was designed to be generous enough to allow for this possibility, and still provide lenders with a greater recovery than they would otherwise receive.
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lhsbandnurd

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2007, 11:00:06 pm »

I assume still no word from Ed...

Does anyone know for sure when the debt sale will be finalized? Doing it the week between Xmas and New Year's seems like a banking nightmare. (Just the sort of thing you'd expect from Prosper.)

Can we even still prove that they said "by the end of the year"?
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2007, 09:21:12 am »

The loan on which I made an offer has been sold, but not to me.

Quote
Loan: Funding for Adult Website (Loan #4018)
Borrower: sharp
Sale date: Dec-27-2007
Sale reason: Delinquency
Principal balance before sale: $96.84
Loan value before sale: $112.27
Proceeds from sale and forfeited group rewards: $7.82

I offered to pay 20.0% of the principal balance.  The loan was sold for 8.1%.  Prosper's decision to accept a lower offer  -- despite its fiduciary responsibility to obtain the highest possible price for lenders -- resulted in a loss of $524.34 to lenders.
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xraider

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2007, 09:43:11 am »

What's your next step, Trav?
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leporello

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2007, 11:27:06 am »

The loan on which I made an offer has been sold, but not to me.

Quote
Loan: Funding for Adult Website (Loan #4018)
Borrower: sharp
Sale date: Dec-27-2007
Sale reason: Delinquency
Principal balance before sale: $96.84
Loan value before sale: $112.27
Proceeds from sale and forfeited group rewards: $7.82

I offered to pay 20.0% of the principal balance.  The loan was sold for 8.1%.  Prosper's decision to accept a lower offer  -- despite its fiduciary responsibility to obtain the highest possible price for lenders -- resulted in a loss of $524.34 to lenders.
Some forum regulars on that loan include Epictetus, Erasmus_Darwin, and somebody named traveler505 (never heard of him); other known lenders are MuleShoes and GeorgeM.

Trav, were there any other loans you offered to buy?

One question I would have is, can Prosper wriggle out of this because you're already a Prosper lender, and their agreements say that lenders can't be JDBs?
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2007, 11:48:26 am »

The loan on which I made an offer has been sold, but not to me.

Quote
Loan: Funding for Adult Website (Loan #4018)
Borrower: sharp
Sale date: Dec-27-2007
Sale reason: Delinquency
Principal balance before sale: $96.84
Loan value before sale: $112.27
Proceeds from sale and forfeited group rewards: $7.82

I offered to pay 20.0% of the principal balance.  The loan was sold for 8.1%.  Prosper's decision to accept a lower offer  -- despite its fiduciary responsibility to obtain the highest possible price for lenders -- resulted in a loss of $524.34 to lenders.
Some forum regulars on that loan include Epictetus, Erasmus_Darwin, and somebody named traveler505 (never heard of him); other known lenders are MuleShoes and GeorgeM.

Trav, were there any other loans you offered to buy?

One question I would have is, can Prosper wriggle out of this because you're already a Prosper lender, and their agreements say that lenders can't be JDBs?


This was the only loan I made an offer on. 

Nothing in the agreements prohibits a lender from being a debt buyer.  The early agreements simply referred to sale to "a debt buyer," later versions changed that to "unaffiliated debt buyer."  The term "unaffiliated," I believe, refers to sale of loans to subsidiaries of Prosper Marketplace Inc.  I don't believe that the term would include lenders, since the agreements make it clear that we are customers, not affiliates. 
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traveler505

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Re: Trav's Do-It-Yourself Secondary Market & Panaderia
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2007, 11:56:33 am »

What's your next step, Trav?

I'm open to suggestions. 
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